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	<title>Comments on: I take issue with the label Green, here&#8217;s why.</title>
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	<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/</link>
	<description>our social web: news and opinion from John Johnston on the state of the social media.</description>
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		<title>By: jjprojects</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4080</link>
		<dc:creator>jjprojects</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 11:08:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>True. I&#039;d say when (not if) there is eventually a price placed on carbon, that will force the issue to a certain extent, as far as climate goes anyway. The issue is wider than climate though of course.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>True. I&#39;d say when (not if) there is eventually a price placed on carbon, that will force the issue to a certain extent, as far as climate goes anyway. The issue is wider than climate though of course.</p>
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		<title>By: servantofchaos</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4079</link>
		<dc:creator>servantofchaos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 10:39:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Business people won&#039;t seriously turn away because of a label. They will turn away because there is no linkage between the issue and its impact on their business. The real challenge is making that tangible link.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Business people won&#39;t seriously turn away because of a label. They will turn away because there is no linkage between the issue and its impact on their business. The real challenge is making that tangible link.</p>
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		<title>By: jjprojects</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4078</link>
		<dc:creator>jjprojects</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 06:32:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4078</guid>
		<description>Perhaps you are correct there Greg. I doubt they&#039;d consider a name change but some of their policies are certainly starting to appeal to a wider group of people, giving the situation we find ourselves in. I know quite a few people who like some of their policies but just hate the name The Greens.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps you are correct there Greg. I doubt they&#39;d consider a name change but some of their policies are certainly starting to appeal to a wider group of people, giving the situation we find ourselves in. I know quite a few people who like some of their policies but just hate the name The Greens.</p>
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		<title>By: jjprojects</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4077</link>
		<dc:creator>jjprojects</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 06:29:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4077</guid>
		<description>Thanks Diana, ah well you see, I just Googled Holistic Planet and although that is still the first result (for now), the number two result is your Twitter, so you&#039;re making headway already :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Diana, ah well you see, I just Googled Holistic Planet and although that is still the first result (for now), the number two result is your Twitter, so you&#39;re making headway already :)</p>
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		<title>By: jjprojects</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4074</link>
		<dc:creator>jjprojects</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 06:12:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4074</guid>
		<description>Thanks Gavin, yes, I&#039;m certainly not saying we need to marginalise the issue by changing the name. I&#039;m saying the same thing really, that we need to build on it, open it up so it can become totally mainstream. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I don&#039;t think green is going to do the whole job though, although, as I said, it&#039;s been really useful. The thing is, people in suits in boardrooms, the people who can really make a difference in terms of emissions (for example), I think need something a little different to drive change. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If we are going to have labels, whatever works is fine I think - sustainability, clean _____, slow food, eco____. I think Green though, is always going to turn off a certain group of people, perhaps those that can actually make the biggest difference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Gavin, yes, I&#39;m certainly not saying we need to marginalise the issue by changing the name. I&#39;m saying the same thing really, that we need to build on it, open it up so it can become totally mainstream. </p>
<p>I don&#39;t think green is going to do the whole job though, although, as I said, it&#39;s been really useful. The thing is, people in suits in boardrooms, the people who can really make a difference in terms of emissions (for example), I think need something a little different to drive change. </p>
<p>If we are going to have labels, whatever works is fine I think &#8211; sustainability, clean _____, slow food, eco____. I think Green though, is always going to turn off a certain group of people, perhaps those that can actually make the biggest difference.</p>
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		<title>By: jjprojects</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4075</link>
		<dc:creator>jjprojects</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 06:00:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4075</guid>
		<description>Thanks Julie, yes, I understand what you mean about people coming to a somewhat different way of living after health, job and lifestyle concerns, quite often stress related it seems. Along with environmental concerns, there seems to be a growing awareness that many of our contemporary lifestyles are unsustainable. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;So many people spend an incredible amount of hours at work, often to the detriment of their health, friends and family. I know in Australia, on average, we now work some of the longest hours in the world. Laid back Australia is a bit of a myth these days. Many of the people who have made changes, or have been forced to make changes after a health scare (for instance) wouldn&#039;t consider themselves Green for doing so.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;As far as the labels go, sure marketers certainly love a label. The environmental movement certainly came out of a grassroots thing, and it seems to me like there is a growing movement now that doesn&#039;t have a label. Sometimes labels are put on it, but its many things many possible labels - the slow food movement, organics, sea and tree changes, cleantech. To my mind, it&#039;s all part of the same thing, and it is grassroots at its core.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Julie, yes, I understand what you mean about people coming to a somewhat different way of living after health, job and lifestyle concerns, quite often stress related it seems. Along with environmental concerns, there seems to be a growing awareness that many of our contemporary lifestyles are unsustainable. </p>
<p>So many people spend an incredible amount of hours at work, often to the detriment of their health, friends and family. I know in Australia, on average, we now work some of the longest hours in the world. Laid back Australia is a bit of a myth these days. Many of the people who have made changes, or have been forced to make changes after a health scare (for instance) wouldn&#39;t consider themselves Green for doing so.</p>
<p>As far as the labels go, sure marketers certainly love a label. The environmental movement certainly came out of a grassroots thing, and it seems to me like there is a growing movement now that doesn&#39;t have a label. Sometimes labels are put on it, but its many things many possible labels &#8211; the slow food movement, organics, sea and tree changes, cleantech. To my mind, it&#39;s all part of the same thing, and it is grassroots at its core.</p>
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		<title>By: jjprojects</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4076</link>
		<dc:creator>jjprojects</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 05:39:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4076</guid>
		<description>Thanks Jacob, I appreciate from our ongoing conversations on Twitter you&#039;ve thought about these things in some detail. What I find particularly interesting is what you are saying in relation to the emerging &quot;sustainable&quot; or &quot;clean&quot; commercial model not being sustainable either, because it still relies on unsustainable resources, and as you say, the economics essentially has it wrong. Rare Earth metals mining comes to mind here, which get used in quite a few cleantech products. I think you&#039;ve said too, that clean energy isn&#039;t going to be efficient enough to completely do the job that fossils are doing now. Is that right?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I guess time will tell. I&#039;m assuming there will eventually be a price placed on carbon and that will drive a boom in a whole new set of industries and should make some older ones not viable in the long term. I might also say that it could lead to a boom and bust cycle in the area of cleantech, just as we had one in hi-tech at the turn of the century. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;There is of course potential there for a sub-prime type investment situation developing, if carbon trading takes off. I can just see people investing in speculative schemes that don&#039;t exist on the ground, and then that all come tumbling down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Jacob, I appreciate from our ongoing conversations on Twitter you&#39;ve thought about these things in some detail. What I find particularly interesting is what you are saying in relation to the emerging &#8220;sustainable&#8221; or &#8220;clean&#8221; commercial model not being sustainable either, because it still relies on unsustainable resources, and as you say, the economics essentially has it wrong. Rare Earth metals mining comes to mind here, which get used in quite a few cleantech products. I think you&#39;ve said too, that clean energy isn&#39;t going to be efficient enough to completely do the job that fossils are doing now. Is that right?</p>
<p>I guess time will tell. I&#39;m assuming there will eventually be a price placed on carbon and that will drive a boom in a whole new set of industries and should make some older ones not viable in the long term. I might also say that it could lead to a boom and bust cycle in the area of cleantech, just as we had one in hi-tech at the turn of the century. </p>
<p>There is of course potential there for a sub-prime type investment situation developing, if carbon trading takes off. I can just see people investing in speculative schemes that don&#39;t exist on the ground, and then that all come tumbling down.</p>
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		<title>By: servantofchaos</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4073</link>
		<dc:creator>servantofchaos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 01:23:28 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I often find that there are questions around label or brand precisely at the point where it begins to become mainstream. Those who have been part of the movement from the edge to the centre experience fatigue at precisely the point they need to redouble their efforts. So the question is not really whether we need a new label or brand.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The equity that has been stored in the term &quot;Green&quot; over the last 20 years is extremely valuable. It may not be the best term, but it&#039;s the best we have. It is not time to marginalise an important issue by changing the name, it is time to build on 20 years of discussion, debate and support and bring it to the mainstream.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I often find that there are questions around label or brand precisely at the point where it begins to become mainstream. Those who have been part of the movement from the edge to the centre experience fatigue at precisely the point they need to redouble their efforts. So the question is not really whether we need a new label or brand.</p>
<p>The equity that has been stored in the term &#8220;Green&#8221; over the last 20 years is extremely valuable. It may not be the best term, but it&#39;s the best we have. It is not time to marginalise an important issue by changing the name, it is time to build on 20 years of discussion, debate and support and bring it to the mainstream.</p>
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		<title>By: Diana</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4234</link>
		<dc:creator>Diana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 22:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4234</guid>
		<description>Labels are useful on filing cabinets and storage jars but they can be misleading. I renamed my Green Twitter list as Holistic Planet to represent a wider range of organisations and people who are working towards making the world a better place. Ironically, the first result for Holistic Planet on Google read &quot;Not Found. Sorry, but you are looking for something that isn&#039;t here&quot;. I&#039;m ever hopeful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Labels are useful on filing cabinets and storage jars but they can be misleading. I renamed my Green Twitter list as Holistic Planet to represent a wider range of organisations and people who are working towards making the world a better place. Ironically, the first result for Holistic Planet on Google read &#8220;Not Found. Sorry, but you are looking for something that isn&#8217;t here&#8221;. I&#8217;m ever hopeful.</p>
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		<title>By: JulieG</title>
		<link>http://www.jjprojects.com/2010/07/21/i-take-issue-with-the-label-green-heres-why/comment-page-1/#comment-4071</link>
		<dc:creator>JulieG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 12:46:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jjprojects.com/?p=2966#comment-4071</guid>
		<description>Interesting. I think *a* label is necessary, in order to distinguish the qualities we are looking for from &#039;business as usual&#039;. But Green doesn&#039;t necessarily have to be *the* label. However, I don&#039;t have any useful suggestions for replacing it. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;In the past, I&#039;ve seen things like health concerns and job concerns and lifestyle concerns bring people over to a greener way of living, without them specifically seeking out Green as such. It&#039;s only after they&#039;re on board that their tolerance for the label and the more difficult issues increases. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Perhaps we need more of a lifestyle label than an issues-based one. Not a marketing driving one (although I&#039;m sure the PR flacks will co-opt it as soon as we think of it), but a real grassroots thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting. I think *a* label is necessary, in order to distinguish the qualities we are looking for from &#39;business as usual&#39;. But Green doesn&#39;t necessarily have to be *the* label. However, I don&#39;t have any useful suggestions for replacing it. </p>
<p>In the past, I&#39;ve seen things like health concerns and job concerns and lifestyle concerns bring people over to a greener way of living, without them specifically seeking out Green as such. It&#39;s only after they&#39;re on board that their tolerance for the label and the more difficult issues increases. </p>
<p>Perhaps we need more of a lifestyle label than an issues-based one. Not a marketing driving one (although I&#39;m sure the PR flacks will co-opt it as soon as we think of it), but a real grassroots thing.</p>
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